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July 22, 2008

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Jennie

Interestingly, I was in the process of writing an entry about the use of space issue when you posted this. (I just posted mine)

I don't think anything you might have done differently would have ultimately made much of a difference. I am not conflict avoidant, but my husband is. I don't think the willingness to discuss issues is as important as each person's orientation towards marriage. Avoidance can be used as a form of covert aggression just as much as an overt power grab.

In a healthy relationship both people will see the other person's needs as being just as important as their own. When there is a conflict of needs, the parties will focus on ways that each of them can get their needs met. There will be compromise and give and take.

If one person has a "power over" orientation, and does not see marriage as an equal partnership, you might "win" a few by fighting like hell but ultimately everybody loses.

Laura

Jennie,
Thanks for your insights. I'm wondering if a relationship can start out healthy and become unhealthy? I try to think that at some point mine was healthy and that the continued interaction of our personalities made it the disaster it became. My trying to deal with him caused me to act (or not act) in the ways I did. This action/reaction only gets worse as we react to previous violations, with no mitigating niceness (real or perceived) at a certain point. My further retreat and his increased demands were all that was possible.

Avi

I have definitely experienced this. I always felt the pain of being "dematerialized" in our "home". Hmmm, maybe that's why my office is such a mess, I do after all need to keep my stuff somewhere.

It took me until just a few days ago to think of this "dematerializing" as perhaps one more way in which my "wife" has been controlling me during our 13 years of "marriage".

Laura

Avi,
I don't know if it is dematerializing you or materializing you. Don't you think that these controllers see us more as objects to direct/push/control rather than full-bodied peers with which to interact? Maybe a real problem is that they are unable to see people as "real" as they see themselves.
Laura

Avi

Laura,

You are so right in what you say about us becoming "materialized". i.e. material objects to be controlled, used, whatever.

What I meant by the term "dematerialized" was I had been slowly but surely deprived of the right to keep any material things at home. I do not even have a place to keep my keys anymore... It has always been in the name of having a tidy home, which it is. Thus my unclarity as to whether this is a controlling behavior on the part of my wife or not. The feeling I always had though was that "there is no room for me here"

Jennie

Laura, I think a relationship can start out healthy and then turn. I have heard of many such cases.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you talk about being seen as objects rather than as real people. That's why Patricia Evan's book, "Controlling People" makes so much sense to me.

She says there is usually a point at which the controlling person feels sufficiently 'safe' that the other won't leave, that they anchor their 'pretend person' in our bodies.

Avi, I can understand the confusion about whether the condition of the house is control when it is tidy. Especially given the traditional female role of housekeeping.

I guess I would look at the objects in the home. Are they hers? yours? both of yours?

What was the process by which it was decided what went where? Were you preferences and needs taken into consideration and balanced with hers?

Laura

Jennie,
I never quite got that point of hers, it seems so cartoonish (the anti-thesis of a superhero, perhaps). I have no theory, I just have my experience with this one man, and I think that behaviors that didn't look bad with rose-colored glasses on lost their lustre when they came off over time, and when he was not lauded his negative persona took over. Conjecture.

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